WEBVTT

NOTE Paragraph

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LOVE WITHOUT FEAR

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<i>I've been asked to participate</i>
<i>in a film about AIDS.</i>

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<i>I've heard and read a little</i>
<i>about this disease,</i>

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<i>and talked about it too.</i>

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<i>There are statistics, figures,</i>
<i>and I know,</i>

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<i>that they mask</i>
<i>stories of disease and death.</i>

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<i>But what does it have to do with me,</i>
<i>with me personally?</i>

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<i>I don't feel affected.</i>

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<i>It's the same for many others.</i>

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<i>What should we say?</i>

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<i>Here's a new, dangerous disease.</i>

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<i>Our behaviours need to change.</i>

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<i>There are things</i>

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<i>to learn, again.</i>

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<i>Prescriptions</i>

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<i>and limitations, again.</i>

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<i>We obey, for the sake of reason.</i>

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<i>But what does reason</i>
<i>have to do with sex?</i>

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<i>Who wants to be told what to do?</i>

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<i>Here, love can start.</i>

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<i>But someone could also</i>
<i>pick you up here, for one night.</i>

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<i>Sleeping with someone I don't love</i>
<i>isn't for me.</i>

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<i>But...</i>

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<i>If you're really lonely,</i>

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<i>and you meet someone you really like...</i>

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<i>Would I think of AIDS then?</i>

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Do you need
to protect yourself from AIDS?

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Actually, no.

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Why not?

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- You have no special friend?
- Yes, I do.

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So why do you think
you need no protection?

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Well, because my girlfriend is normal.

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- Normal people can't catch it?
- What?

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Normals can't catch it?

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Yes, they can.
But at least, the missus's clean.

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I have a steady boyfriend.
I can't see... I don't need to.

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- What about you?
- Same.

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Otherwise, I'd use condoms.
Well, not me, the guy.

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- For me personally, no.
- Why not?

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Well, you know...
No time left.

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I'll be tied down from Wednesday,
that's it for me.

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If you do it right, I have no fear.

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- What does "doing it right" mean?
- Being faithful or using condoms.

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For some people, it's a huge risk.

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I used to live differently too
but I wouldn't repeat that now.

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To me, it's important to talk about it,

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because you don't know,
all the foreigners...

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So many come here.

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If you go steady, and you know exactly
who you've been with,

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then it's no problem.

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I wouldn't say AIDS is a big issue
for many people here.

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Many can more or less
control themselves.

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I have a steady girl.
I'm becoming a father and stuff.

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I don't need
to use condoms or whatever.

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I'm feeling rather safe.

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You'll never go off the rail?

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In principle, no, I'd say.

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And if you did, would you use a condom?

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I guess not.

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Because it's nonsense.

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And you?

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I fucking don't care.

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You fucking don't care about AIDS or...

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Problem is...
It's her problem, not mine.

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<i>What allegedly good reasons</i>

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<i>do we use to push AIDS</i>
<i>to the back of our conscience?</i>

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<i>We assume</i>
<i>AIDS always befalls the others.</i>

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<i>But it's transmitted</i>
<i>by people who love each other,</i>

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<i>or at least when they love each other.</i>

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<i>Sure, in a true, faithful relationship,</i>
<i>AIDS is not an issue.</i>

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<i>But what if you break up?</i>

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<i>What if you're still looking</i>
<i>for someone?</i>

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<i>Then there's still a risk.</i>

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<i>I can't imagine</i>
<i>living and loving with no risk.</i>

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<i>But where does carelessness begin?</i>

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<i>The more I delve into this subject,</i>

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<i>the less I can ignore it.</i>

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<i>I often think about when</i>
<i>and with whom I slept,</i>

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<i>and with whom he did,</i>
<i>and with whom he or she did.</i>

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<i>It makes you feel unsecure.</i>

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<i>Still, we agreed this film</i>
<i>shouldn't frighten anyone,</i>

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<i>because fear can't protect you.</i>

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DR. A. SCHOLZ
HEAD OF DERMATOLOGY

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Is it possible for the patient to impact

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the disease in any way,

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or the course of the disease?

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In addition to the patient's
personal attitude and outlook,

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it's very important
to have regular medical check-ups.

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That's why we have set up

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what we call "AIDS advice centres"
in each district of the GDR.

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Here, on the one hand,

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when patients
have been diagnosed as HIV-positive,

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they get medical advice.

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When an infection turns up,
it's handled immediately,

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so as not to strain
their immune system for too long.

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On the other hand, there are
numerous psychosocial issues

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they experience after discovering
that they're HIV-positive.

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When someone's in doubt,

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would you advise them
to have an HIV test?

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I feel nervous or hesitant,
just thinking

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of directly getting a test.

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I always try to do it indirectly,
when donating blood,

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because I fear those intimate questions.

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I'd have to admit then,

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that I've slept with people
I actually didn't really know,

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without telling them: "We barely know
each other, use a condom."

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That's exactly
what we don't want you to do.

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When you donate blood,

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which you should do,
it's a very good thing...

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But for us doctors...

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Actually, you should trust us doctors.

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It's important that this conversation...
Is your fear legitimate?

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Have some of your prejudices
grown out of proportion

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and developed into fear?

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We always have this conversation
before doing an HIV test.

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I'd like to add
that you need to wait 6 weeks...

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There must be a waiting period
after unprotected intercourse

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with someone you had suspicions about.

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Then we can perform the test.

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And let's address a theme
that comes up regularly in the press:

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anonymity.

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The lab analysing your blood sample

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will never use your name and address.

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They will provide you with a code,
and then we'll...

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We'll be able to identify your sample.

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I kind of feel that many youth
turn away from AIDS as an issue.

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Do you have the same experience
in your work?

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Over the past 2 years,

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we've given numerous lectures
in our own area,

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and we've had many discussions.

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We've conveyed information
through the media.

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We see AIDS

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as one type
of sexually-transmitted disease,

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because that's the most common
mode of transmission here.

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In these discussions,

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and in the course of the disease, we see

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that, over the past 2 years,
there have been shifts in behaviour.

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- Positive ones?
- Yes.

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People have become more careful,

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or, something we need to count too,

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they have used more condoms.

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It means that the almost forgotten
"rubber protection"

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is decidedly being used
against STDs again.

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It's also the most crucial piece of info
we can give about AIDS:

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STDs can only be impacted

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through personal responsibility
toward your partner.

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<i>We can protect ourselves against AIDS.</i>

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<i>A little rubber shouldn't be an issue.</i>

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<i>Theoretically, I realise that.</i>
<i>But practically...</i>

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<i>It starts with buying</i>

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<i>the thing.</i>

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I'd like a bag of coffee.

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- Moccafix?
- Yes.

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Anything else?

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I'd like to buy condoms.

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Which ones would you like?

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I don't know the types.

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I'll show you.

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We have <i>Mondos Feucht, Gold,</i>

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<i>Luxus</i> and <i>Perfekt.</i>

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Or <i>Spezial.</i>

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What's the difference?

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- These are moister and these are dryer.
- OK.

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- How many pieces in a package?
- 3 here and 1 there.

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How much do they cost?

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This is 2 Mark and this is 1.65.

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That's just 1.

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Well, then...

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- I'd like 2 of these.
- Yes.

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<i>Before sleeping together,</i>

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<i>there's a moment when you decide</i>
<i>whether to be safe or not.</i>

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<i>If you miss it and keep quiet</i>
<i>for fear of ruining the mood,</i>

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<i>it may have already happened.</i>

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<i>You don't need much courage though,</i>

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<i>just the confidence to say:</i>

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<i>"Listen, because I care for you,</i>

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<i>"let's be safe."</i>

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<i>It's better than uncertainty</i>
<i>and self-blame afterwards.</i>

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<i>Or is it still true</i>
<i>that: "Love is blind"?</i>

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I'd like to introduce myself.
I'm Udo Zobel.

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I work at the AIDS discussion group
at the <i>Courage </i>work alliance<i>.</i>

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This AIDS discussion group
started in 1987.

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It was actually founded

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to give advice and care
to people affected by AIDS.

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And we do prevention work

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through lectures

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educational events,
distribution of flyers...

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I've taken on the lecture part
to open the dialogue with people,

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talking about the pros and cons
of specific things.

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We've heard the key points,
we think we know it all.

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We'll see

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how concrete questions bring out fears,
fear of physical contact,

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and inhibitions.

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We know precisely
about transmission paths.

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It happens mainly
through anal and vaginal intercourse,

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and oral intercourse,
with the mouth, OK?

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Gays do that.

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Why are they particularly in danger?
You say "gays".

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Well, because...

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Because, in principle,
they're the carriers.

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- They're the carriers.
- Yes?

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They infect themselves, so to say,

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then they can transmit it forward.

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Women can too.

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You can get it from anybody
and pass it on.

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Don't blame it on the gays, saying:
"It's their fault". It isn't.

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You can't say: "They're gay,
yuck, they invented AIDS."

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They didn't.

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The virus doesn't care at all
whether you're a man, a woman

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 or a child.

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The main thing is, there are
prerequisites to getting infected.

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Infected body fluids
must get in contact with your blood.

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Safer sex means

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no unprotected vaginal,
anal or oral intercourse.

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There's an old means,
actually not old,

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something has become modern again...

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What's its name?
Condom, sheath, rubber...

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It has so many names.

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We know it.

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We've blown it out,
filled it with water,

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annoyed people with it,
who didn't?

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But when it comes to really using it...
We won't practice for real here though.

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I've brought a few condoms.

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I'm going to hand them out.

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Here, take it.
You can have one too.

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Here you go.

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Over there, at the back.

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Here you are.

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Who's going to dare show
how to use it properly?

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Show us then, roll it on and show...

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Use your fingers, maybe.
Show us.

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Let's go.

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Check out whether he's doing it right.

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Well, if you do it like this,
there's a great hazard.

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It could leak, yes.

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For me, there should be
some air in your mate there.

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Your mate!

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I mean, be logical,
look at the device.

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- There's a doodad here, in front.
- What's it called?

00:14:57.280 --> 00:14:58.920
- No idea.
- A reservoir.

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- Exactly, like a...
- A catch basin.

00:15:02.680 --> 00:15:06.920
So if you put it on too tightly,
your load can't get out, I mean...

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Then it's somehow...

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Either you tear it off or...
I mean...

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- Like I said...
- It's rubbish?

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You need, you need to...

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You need some room.

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I've brought a few photos.

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You can look at "real life".

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I'm going to stand up.

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Like we said...
Can we...

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Let's get on with it.

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The member
should be really stiff, erected.

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That's... 
In German...

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Then you can pull it on,

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and look,
squeeze at the top.

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There should be no air bubble left.

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So squeeze at the top.

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Some hold it with their fist,
others like this,

00:15:49.920 --> 00:15:51.800
whatever's comfortable for you.

00:15:51.960 --> 00:15:54.080
Then roll it down, 
you got that right,

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roll it down tightly.

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On this prevention topic,
they say you should include it

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into sexual foreplay but...

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Well, either I would, I don't know,
laugh out of insecurity or...

00:16:07.800 --> 00:16:10.840
I can't imagine how to do it so that...

00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:13.960
Manual skills are involved somehow.

00:16:14.120 --> 00:16:18.160
Arousal won't last forever,
if I tear it open now,

00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:19.840
then it's too late.

00:16:20.000 --> 00:16:21.280
Practice makes perfect.

00:16:21.440 --> 00:16:24.000
How do you practice?
In front of a mirror?

00:16:24.720 --> 00:16:25.520
Won't help.

00:16:25.680 --> 00:16:29.320
Make an effort, use your imagination,
that kind of thing.

00:16:30.040 --> 00:16:33.920
I think they should be free.
Others can think otherwise.

00:16:34.080 --> 00:16:36.000
The issue is: do people use it?

00:16:36.160 --> 00:16:39.960
You're right but let's assume
you don't have much dough left,

00:16:40.120 --> 00:16:43.640
Do you buy this
or 10 bread rolls with your last Mark?

00:16:43.800 --> 00:16:46.120
OK, don't be cross now.

00:16:46.400 --> 00:16:48.160
You meet someone, right?

00:16:48.320 --> 00:16:50.320
Then tell me...
I mean...

00:16:50.680 --> 00:16:54.520
It could be, couldn't it?
And when you think about this topic...

00:16:54.680 --> 00:16:56.400
You get to know them better...

00:16:57.680 --> 00:16:59.160
But this topic is rejected,

00:16:59.320 --> 00:17:00.840
totally rejected,

00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:02.000
talking about it.

00:17:02.160 --> 00:17:05.200
"Are you stupid or what?"
That's the answer I got.

00:17:05.360 --> 00:17:06.680
Or

00:17:06.840 --> 00:17:09.960
"No, not that.
Shall we do it or... What time is it?"

00:17:10.120 --> 00:17:12.080
Or nothing at all.
It's like that.

00:17:12.560 --> 00:17:15.360
You feel silly
when you tell a girl: "Wait."

00:17:16.920 --> 00:17:18.080
Silently, right?

00:17:18.240 --> 00:17:20.760
Now the girl thinks:
"Is he nutty or what?"

00:17:20.920 --> 00:17:23.640
You don't know what she thinks about it.

00:17:23.800 --> 00:17:27.800
If she says: "I'd rather do it
with a condom", then good,

00:17:28.360 --> 00:17:30.040
let's do it with a condom.

00:17:30.320 --> 00:17:34.680
But you feel ashamed...
Both partners feel ashamed, I'd say.

00:17:34.840 --> 00:17:36.280
Bear it in mind.

00:17:36.560 --> 00:17:38.840
Well, you collect experiences, right?

00:17:39.440 --> 00:17:41.880
And AIDS wasn't around yet.

00:17:42.040 --> 00:17:44.440
Naturally, I didn't take the pill, etc.

00:17:44.600 --> 00:17:47.080
Why does the woman
always have to take charge?

00:17:47.240 --> 00:17:49.240
"You do this, you calculate, you..."

00:17:49.400 --> 00:17:52.400
I said: "John Doe,
use the thing or you get zilch."

00:17:52.560 --> 00:17:54.880
And he used one and it worked...

00:17:55.040 --> 00:17:59.240
You know?
I can't understand why you don't dare.

00:17:59.840 --> 00:18:04.280
Is it about self-confidence
or do you feel somehow... I don't know.

00:18:05.120 --> 00:18:07.280
Maybe I was raised wrong.
Could be.

00:18:07.480 --> 00:18:10.160
If you feel relaxed in the relationship,

00:18:10.320 --> 00:18:13.800
all you have to do is smile and say:

00:18:13.960 --> 00:18:15.760
"Hey, John Doe, this or that."

00:18:15.920 --> 00:18:17.440
For others, it's hard.

00:18:17.600 --> 00:18:20.200
They want to ask
but fear being laughed at,

00:18:20.360 --> 00:18:21.160
and the like,

00:18:21.320 --> 00:18:24.040
so they don't ask
and they hold back.

00:18:24.200 --> 00:18:28.040
Let's turn this around.
For example, you tell a guy...

00:18:28.200 --> 00:18:30.720
Say, you'd told me,
when I was 16, 17:

00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:32.400
"Use the thing or else."

00:18:32.560 --> 00:18:35.440
It would have stopped me
for several years.

00:18:35.600 --> 00:18:37.600
I wouldn't have tried again, OK?

00:18:38.440 --> 00:18:39.920
I don't want to be like my parents.

00:18:40.080 --> 00:18:42.680
When I have children,
I'll do things differently.

00:18:42.840 --> 00:18:44.600
Start changing now,

00:18:44.760 --> 00:18:47.880
by starting to change with your partner.

00:18:48.360 --> 00:18:52.000
More importantly, with AIDS,
we have the possibility

00:18:52.160 --> 00:18:55.360
to prevent it
through our own initiative.

00:18:55.880 --> 00:18:58.000
Do you have...
No, not with...

00:19:00.080 --> 00:19:02.480
Not in the same proportion
as with AIDS.

00:19:17.400 --> 00:19:20.960
<i>We need to talk</i>
<i>about the emotional part of sex,</i>

00:19:21.200 --> 00:19:23.280
<i>and about sexual responsibility.</i>

00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:27.160
<i>It's about getting close</i>
<i>to another human being,</i>

00:19:27.320 --> 00:19:29.880
<i>allowing both sides to hold their own,</i>

00:19:30.040 --> 00:19:31.920
<i>and reach compromises.</i>

00:19:32.440 --> 00:19:34.360
<i>But you need to learn it first.</i>

00:19:56.120 --> 00:19:58.080
<i>It was difficult to find</i>

00:19:58.320 --> 00:20:01.160
<i>an infected person</i>
<i>ready to talk on camera.</i>

00:20:02.080 --> 00:20:03.040
<i>Too many of us</i>

00:20:03.280 --> 00:20:05.760
<i>reject infected people out of ignorance</i>

00:20:05.920 --> 00:20:07.520
<i>and intolerance.</i>

00:20:08.320 --> 00:20:10.920
<i>A sad chapter of our research.</i>

00:20:12.680 --> 00:20:14.520
<i>I felt inhibited too at first.</i>

00:20:14.720 --> 00:20:16.680
<i>I was afraid my questions</i>

00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:17.840
<i>would hurt.</i>

00:20:18.320 --> 00:20:22.560
You told me that you were
infected in October last year.

00:20:22.720 --> 00:20:24.000
What was that like?

00:20:25.080 --> 00:20:30.360
Well first, as for everybody surely,
there's a shock, isn't there?

00:20:30.520 --> 00:20:32.840
First, you don't really understand.

00:20:33.160 --> 00:20:37.640
If you're a bit sensitive,
you want to harm yourself.

00:20:38.520 --> 00:20:41.880
There were suicidal thoughts.

00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:44.440
A few days later...

00:20:44.760 --> 00:20:46.920
- I got the flu.
- The flu?

00:20:47.080 --> 00:20:48.440
Yes, the flu.

00:20:48.720 --> 00:20:53.200
So you're sitting here all alone,
nobody's here,

00:20:53.720 --> 00:20:55.440
and you fight with yourself.

00:20:55.600 --> 00:20:57.480
This could be the end.

00:20:58.680 --> 00:20:59.840
I have my fears,

00:21:00.120 --> 00:21:03.000
my aspirations and stuff, of course,

00:21:03.160 --> 00:21:04.720
but I'm still saying:

00:21:05.760 --> 00:21:10.440
"You're still alive.
You're infected, that's serious.

00:21:11.160 --> 00:21:13.400
"Continue to hope for a cure."

00:21:13.800 --> 00:21:18.600
It's the biggest hope you can have
although it hasn't materialised yet.

00:21:19.040 --> 00:21:21.440
Why didn't you protect yourself,

00:21:21.600 --> 00:21:23.360
I mean, with a condom?

00:21:24.160 --> 00:21:30.120
Well, I knew a lot about it,
how to protect yourself, the like,

00:21:30.840 --> 00:21:33.600
but you don't walk around

00:21:33.760 --> 00:21:36.160
thinking about it all day.

00:21:36.320 --> 00:21:39.080
Maybe when you start a relationship,

00:21:39.600 --> 00:21:44.160
maybe you want
to have some "hot" moments.

00:21:44.360 --> 00:21:47.200
You don't think,
and then suddenly it happens.

00:21:47.480 --> 00:21:49.920
Of course, I'd act differently today.

00:21:50.960 --> 00:21:52.880
I haven't told my parents,

00:21:53.520 --> 00:21:56.000
because I want to see them as they are.

00:21:56.240 --> 00:21:58.360
I'm sure that if I told them,

00:21:58.520 --> 00:22:01.560
they would look at me differently,

00:22:02.000 --> 00:22:03.880
with pity.

00:22:04.240 --> 00:22:09.000
I'm still their son for them,
and so it shall remain.

00:22:09.440 --> 00:22:13.080
They'll learn about it
when, let's say, sadly,

00:22:13.240 --> 00:22:14.400
it's too late.

00:22:15.160 --> 00:22:17.840
I can imagine
that it will bring them down,

00:22:18.440 --> 00:22:21.640
but from my point of view,
it's the best way.

00:22:21.840 --> 00:22:22.640
Really?

00:22:23.360 --> 00:22:27.200
Don't you think your parents
could be good allies for you,

00:22:27.360 --> 00:22:29.440
precisely in that situation?

00:22:30.080 --> 00:22:32.120
I know my mother would be for me.

00:22:32.680 --> 00:22:35.320
I have a very good ally,
my life partner.

00:22:36.760 --> 00:22:38.520
I can really talk openly

00:22:38.800 --> 00:22:40.400
about everything with him.

00:22:40.840 --> 00:22:43.280
But it's true, you do need an ally.

00:22:44.080 --> 00:22:47.120
What did you think
were the pros and cons

00:22:47.280 --> 00:22:51.800
of accepting this interview for a film?

00:22:52.840 --> 00:22:55.240
For me, it's an opportunity to say

00:22:55.400 --> 00:22:57.560
that this disease

00:22:57.960 --> 00:23:00.400
isn't a disgusting one,

00:23:00.680 --> 00:23:04.520
that it's really here,
and that we need to try

00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:08.760
to fight it with all the means
currently available.

00:23:10.200 --> 00:23:12.960
Be it by using condoms
to protect ourselves

00:23:13.120 --> 00:23:14.800
or through partner selection.

00:23:16.080 --> 00:23:17.240
I'd like to say

00:23:18.400 --> 00:23:21.040
that I always looked
for stable relationships.

00:23:21.920 --> 00:23:25.360
I would advise other people
to do the same,

00:23:25.520 --> 00:23:28.400
if they're currently looking
for a new friend.

00:23:28.720 --> 00:23:31.880
Really talk with them first.

00:23:32.280 --> 00:23:36.320
Build a trusting relationship,
don't go to bed straight away.

00:23:36.640 --> 00:23:37.720
I'd like to think

00:23:38.400 --> 00:23:40.600
that after a while, you're so strong

00:23:40.760 --> 00:23:43.520
that you can say:
"Let's do the test together,

00:23:44.280 --> 00:23:45.480
"let's go."

00:23:45.840 --> 00:23:50.280
It demonstrates
that it's real love and not just

00:23:50.520 --> 00:23:51.960
any relationship.

00:23:57.080 --> 00:23:58.840
<i>I don't know what the film</i>

00:23:59.080 --> 00:24:00.760
<i>will trigger in viewers.</i>

00:24:01.000 --> 00:24:04.560
<i>I can only say how I feel</i>
<i>at the end of this project.</i>

00:24:05.560 --> 00:24:07.320
<i>Maybe we shouldn't turn</i>

00:24:07.600 --> 00:24:09.440
<i>to clichés where love is concerned.</i>

00:24:09.600 --> 00:24:11.720
<i>I want to love and be loved.</i>

00:24:11.880 --> 00:24:13.840
<i>Without fear or a bad conscience,</i>

00:24:14.000 --> 00:24:16.120
<i>without blaming myself and others.</i>

00:24:17.040 --> 00:24:19.360
<i>Maybe the first step is to ask myself:</i>

00:24:20.240 --> 00:24:22.040
<i>"What do I really want?"</i>

00:24:22.400 --> 00:24:23.800
<i>"What matters to me?"</i>

00:24:25.200 --> 00:24:27.760
<i>My sexuality is part of me.</i>

00:24:28.520 --> 00:24:31.240
<i>It can't be better than I am.</i>

00:24:32.880 --> 00:24:36.000
A FILM FROM THE <i>DEUTSCHES</i>
<i>HYGIENE MUSEUM</i>

00:24:36.160 --> 00:24:39.280
IN THE GERMAN
DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC

00:25:02.920 --> 00:25:04.880
Subtitles: Élisabeth Fuchs